-: I'm Rich Lesser, BCG CEO,
I'm joined here with Mai-Britt Poulsen.
Mai-Britt's our Global Chief of Staff
and our great senior partner
and probably the person I work the most closely with.
So we figured we'd have a conversation
as we celebrate International Women's Day
and the theme this year of Each For Equal.
This agenda's incredibly important to us.
It's something we focus on for ourselves,
how do we boost the ranks of women throughout BCG
in increasing our hiring,
in making sure that our rates of promotion
for men and women stay equal
as they have been for many years,
in terms of how we build the ranks of women
in the senior leadership of the firm.
It's important as we think about
what are the cutting edge topics,
making sure women are in digital,
supporting organizations like Grace Hopper
to help STEM more broadly
and women's accessibility to STEM
and continue to do cutting edge research,
whether it's how to create more inclusion,
how to create more return on the spend
that happens inside companies,
and how to actually support women and men
as they shape their careers.
So, Mai-Britt, it's great to be here with you today.
You've talking about how to get women
into leadership for years.
In fact, I think it was one of the first
really deep conversations we had,
it was research that you did on this years ago.
How do you advise leaders when you're talking to them
about this topic?
-: I always try to take a step back
and look at how is the outlook for the world.
And when we look at the outlook,
we're looking into a more complicated
and more complex world.
We see different geopolitical scenarios,
we see some economic uncertainty,
we see a lot of continued disruption
from digital challengers, and a lot of new technologies.
And to win in the '20s, in the coming decade,
diversity and inclusion is going to be very important,
because we see companies that are innovative,
have a better financial performance,
they are more resilient,
and they are more adapted to changes
in the external environment.
So I always come from the business angle
when I talk to company leaders
and all the leaders around,
why is diversity and inclusion so important.
-: I agree with you completely.
But what I've also found is that when you look at
where things had gone wrong in companies
and where there've been just
poor decisions made that have led to risk issues and others,
you often find environments that are very homogenous,
not just in gender but in other ways.
I think that part of it's innovation and opportunity,
but it's a huge issue as well.
-: Yeah, I agree.
So we see organizations who have a wide range of voices
are better at problem solving
and also detecting different risk scenarios
and acting proactively on them.
-: And the willingness to challenge the status quo,
I just find the more different voices you have in the room,
the more you get that.
Okay, so there's many levers to pull.
But what's at the top of your list
when you're talking to a CEO
about what are the kinds of levers
that make the greatest difference.
-: Yeah, I think we start in the corner office.
And in my book, it's really about ensuring commitment
to diversity and inclusion in the company
and that has to be an agenda that the CEO drives
and the executive team.
So, that's point number one.
Point number two for me is knowing your data
and understanding where are we.
So what is the diversity in each function,
in each geography, and down to a team level,
because if you don't know where you are
it's very hard to set targets
and ask your leaders to advance,
and also have the critical discussions.
Why are we not progressing here?
And then, find solutions.
And then the last thing I would say
is that when we look into female leadership pipelines
often the moment of truth
is when you start a family.
So here, I think, organizations, companies
have a big role to play in terms of supporting
parental leave, flexible working models, and childcare.
-: You're just at that point,
so when I left New York,
this is like 10, 15 years ago,
we lost women in ways that I hadn't realized.
Before they had families,
because they didn't understand how committed
we could be to them after they had families.
And so, I realized, to my surprise,
it wasn't about engaging someone at the moment
they had a family,
it was about showing role models
and engaging with people long before,
so that they saw that we could make it work.
-: Yes.
-: Make it work in like a range of different ways,
not that there's one model,
model you choose is different from someone else's,
for someone else we could do that.
I also find in today's world,
having an environment where men feel like
they can take paternity leaves,
and that it's not just about women
being the primary caregiver,
but you try to create an environment
where people can feel supported with their family choices
regardless of their family structure
and independent of the role that different members
want to play.
I think it's just so important to send the signal,
this isn't a women's issue,
this is supporting families.
-: Yes.
I think that is very important.
And what we've seen when we work with parental policies
is exactly as you say,
it helps the whole family.
-: I spent the last week just doing our partner reviews,
like I sit in this process,
we have 1,400 partners,
so it's a lot to go through.
I was just struck by how many men are starting
to take paternity leaves,
and now how can you talk about these leaves,
and we've come quite a long way.
I think helping our clients
to think about how to make flexibility work,
because each company has different norms and structures,
and how do you engage men in owning that issue,
not just women, as leaders,
is a big deal.
-: Yes, I fully agree with that.
I see a big change in the generations
of younger leaders coming up,
because here the men actually demand to take parental leave.
-: Yes.
-: And they see it as something they're entitled to
and they should.
-: I completely agree.
I also think that how we create,
how we get men to understand the value
of creating inclusivity in their teams,
not just building diversity in their teams,
but creating this sense of inclusion.
It can't just be women helping women, right?
The numbers don't work
but it just doesn't work culturally either.
-: I think it's very right.
When we look at frontline leaders,
that's where we see in our research
who can have the biggest impact on creating
an inclusive environment,
and if you look at today's split between men and women
in leadership roles,
it's very clear that we need to work everybody.
-: So where are you most encouraged about the progress
you've seen?
And where do you feel like we still have
like the biggest gap,
and I don't mean BCG in this case,
I mean just that you talk to so many leaders
on this topic.
What's your sense?
-: So, we've just been in Davos this year
and one of the big conversations beyond climate
and technology,
was diversity and inclusion.
And I was so amazed visiting the Equality Lounge
and seeing a number of top CEOs,
including yourself, Rich,
speaking about diversity and inclusion
in their companies.
That was really a big encouragement for me.
-: There was so much energy
in that room. -: Absolutely.
-: It was really terrific.
-: It was the best lounge.
-: It was my most fun part of the week.
Okay, so we're gonna do a lightning round to end.
What was the best tip your mother ever gave you?
-: I would say my mom was always very supportive
in anything I wanted to do
and she always told me,
I remember from being a very little girl,
always believe in yourself.
The world is your playground
and go for whatever you like.
And it was really an encouragement to me.
-: From mine, my mom was a school teacher,
so the two things I remember
are talking around the dinner table
about just each kid
and where they were coming from
and how you help them to learn,
it was wonderful training to be the CEO
of a professional service
where we have thousands of people
and you're trying to help each one to their full potential.
And the other thing I remember is that
every September I would,
I was taller than she was,
and I had to put the posters on the wall in her room,
like, "When life gives you lemons, make lemonade,"
those sorts of posters. -: Right.
-: But the one that stuck with me for this role is,
"Ships in the harbor are safe,
"but that is not what ships are built for."
And she really believed that
and I really believe that's like,
if you're gonna get a CEO advice,
don't just stay with keep doing what you're doing,
but try new things.
Okay, best tip from a female colleague.
-: It's one of our female leaders at BCG
and she told me when we were talking about
how you put leadership teams together,
and she told me,
pick your leadership team members
as you would pick your babysitter.
And when I asked what do you mean with that?
Then she told me about how she believes
the leaders in the frontline and in your team
having the daily interactions,
are actually the ones making the difference
to whether you build an inclusive environment or not.
-: Final question.
Who is the female leader you would say you admire the most?
-: I would like to pick one from my country,
Helle Thorning-Schmidt,
she's from Denmark.
She's the ex-prime minister,
she actually visited us
at one of our--
-: She was great!
She's one of our all time highest rated speakers.
When she spoke with Save the Children,
when she was leading Save the Children.
-: Exactly!
She's very inspirational.
So, she's been prime minister in Denmark.
She's been the leader of the Save the Children organization,
and now she's pursuing board positions
and building her own business.
And she's actually also advising on diversity and inclusion.
I admire her because she's bold and she's out there
in the frontline,
sometimes challenging the status quo
with some controversial messages.
And I think that's bold and that's what we need
to advance the world.
-: That's a great choice.
Okay, I'm not sure I can top that in the public domain,
so I'll just say,
I think that the female leaders in BCG right now
are just amazing.
I was thinking about our EC,
where you're there,
one of the best client service partners in the firm
helping us drive so much change right now.
Christina, who's at the cutting edge of AI
and also an amazing client service partner.
Carol, who is this foundational person,
and helping us to build in China
and now the chairwoman in China.
Pia doing the same thing in insurance.
Ulrike is this chief legal counsel
who's taking on all these complex issues,
and Sharon who's one of the all-time great
client service people at BCG,
first at consumer and now building public sector.
Look at this leadership ranks.
And of course, that's that group in the Executive Committee
but so many others.
It's just remarkable.
Really I learned so much,
it fills me with optimism about the future.
Thank you everyone.
It was great to be with you and have a wonderful day.
And Each For Equal I think is the theme
that we all can embrace and try
to move forward with together.