WEBVTT

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Kesh, Mandy, hi. Mandy.
Can I start with you?

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We're hearing a lot about
a just energy transition.

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Just explain to me what exactly it is.

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Great question, Georgie.

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So the just energy transition is about
how do we transition towards cleaner

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technologies from a very predominantly
cut fossil fuel-based economies

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worldwide. How do we transition
to a cleaner landscape,

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a cleaner energy landscape, but
do it in a way that is just;

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do it in a way that takes
care of the social impacts,

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and do it in a way that does
not leave anybody behind.

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So a rather inclusive process. Bearing
in mind there's a number of communities,

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a number of people that have based
their entire lives on the coal mining

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industry. And this is why the
partnership that we struck at COP 26,

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the Just Energy Transition Partnership
between South Africa and the UK,

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France, US, European
government, and Germany,

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was extremely important because one
of the key things is who finances,

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and how do you finance a
just energy transition?

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And so that partnership's been all
about how do we finance a just energy

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transition?

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Let's talk about finance, Kesh.

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Why is sustainable finance so important
for a just transition and what's working

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well and what's perhaps,

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leaves a little bit to be desired--room
for improvement, should we say?

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A hundred percent Georgie. So look,

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I think sustainable finance has a
critical role to play in enabling a just

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transition. Yeah.

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If you think about the challenges that
Mandy just talked to around making sure

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that nobody is left behind,

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that means we need to make
sure that people are reskilled,

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that they redeploy to different
sectors of the economy.

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That some of our fossil fuel assets are
accelerated in terms of their path to a

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greener transition. And not all of
those moves are economically viable.

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And so the role of sustainable finance
that can bring in concessional funding to

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help capitalize private sector investment
into making some of these difficult

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moves really flow into implementation
is going to be critical.

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And I think the partnership that Mandy
spoke about is a great example of that.

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Now,

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your question around what's working well
and where are some of the challenges,

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I guess, look, this is a
journey that we're on, right?

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And I think what's working well is that
there is some signals and signposts

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globally around the Global North and the
Global South partnering to make this a

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reality. Yeah,

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I think the deal that Mandy just mentioned
is a good example of what can happen

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when that partnership works,
right? But having said that,

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there are still challenges and next steps
around how do we make sure that that

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funding that's been agreed at bilateral
level now flows efficiently into the

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projects, the governance
structures around that,

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the terms of finance that come with that.

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That's going to be the critical thing
that we now need to double down on,

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particularly when we talk
about implementation.

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Mandy, what other enablers are needed
to ensure a just energy transition?

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Apart from the financing that Kesh
just spoke about and that I mentioned

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earlier, regulatory enablers
are extremely important.

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So having alignment between
industrial policy, energy policy,

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environmental policy,

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and financial policy are key
enablers for us to get a just

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energy transition going.

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There's a number of barriers that you
could inevitably get from regulatory,

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from legislation, from policies,

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from the elements that we see
coming through the legislation.

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And if we overcome those and if we
deal with them in conjunction and in a

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complementary manner,

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we can actually then really get
through a just energy transition.

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The other enabler I think is a mindset
shift. Now that might seem a bit odd,

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but what we have found in implementing
a just energy transition partnership is

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the biggest thing to overcome is the
mindset that we could actually move from

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fossil fuels to renewables and in
doing so, create more jobs. In fact,

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two to one jobs in South Africa could
be created from moving from coal to

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renewables. So having that change
management, having those mindset changes.

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So in other words, the
awareness, the marketing,

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the proper lobbying and advocacy around
just energy transition is absolutely

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crucial to be a success.

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You're nodding along there,
Kesh. Mindset key, is it?

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Yeah, I think 100% agree.

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I think that we've done a lot of thinking
globally around what needs to be done,

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the macroeconomic planning,
the implementation planning,

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but that mind shift change, that
kind of catalyst for collaboration,

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if you will.

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I think that's going to be the critical
thing here because this whole transition

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is going to be super complex.

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It's going to require stakeholders
across society to really work together to

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make this happen.

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And I think that mind shift
change about not just:

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this is government's problem or
this is private sector's problem,

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but this is everybody's problem and we
need to work together to find a solution

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for this, is going to be critical.

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If you say that's everybody's problem,

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it's going to require everybody
working together. What about business?

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Yeah, I think business has a
critical role to play here. I mean,

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if you think about where all of the people
who are going to be most affected by

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the transition work and find their
livelihoods today, it's from business.

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And so I think business needs to stand
up and recognize that the net-zero

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transition is not just about
greening their business,

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but it's greening their business and
coming out more socioeconomically just at

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the end of this transition and
business have the balance sheet,

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the skills, and the influence in society
to really drive a lot of the change.

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They can't do it alone,

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but they definitely have a catalytic
role to play in this entire transition.

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Cash.Mandy, thank you so much.